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Over 640 Iraqis Die in Stampede Sparked by Mortars and Bomb Threats

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  • Over 640 Iraqis Die in Stampede Sparked by Mortars and Bomb Threats

    NDTV
    (India)

    Wednesday, August 31, 2005 (Baghdad):

    Over 600 people are feared dead in a stampede after a mortar attack near a Shiite shrine in Baghdad.

    According to latest reports, the stampede happened on a bride over the Tigris river and many worshippers gathered at the shrine drowned after falling off it.

    Iraqi officials say four mortar rounds landed close to the Kadhimiya mosque in the north of the capital, which triggered panic. A million Shia pilgrims were reportedly on their way to the mosque.

    Panic spread

    Some people jumped off a bridge they were crossing amid rumours of a suicide bomber in the crowd.

    The attack occurred as thousands of Shias were marching as part of an annual religious festival. Unconfirmed reports said about half of those injured by the mortar rounds were women.

    So far no group has claimed responsibility for the attack.

    Iraqis are currently preparing to vote on a proposed Constitution for their country with Shia and Sunnis sharply divided on its contents.

    Today is the last day for the Iraqis to register to participate in the referendum to be held in October.

    -----------------------------------------------------------

    640 killed in Iraq stampede
    Last Updated Wed, 31 Aug 2005 07:53:24 EDT
    CBC News

    As many as 640 people have been killed and 200 injured when a crowd of Iraqi Shias stampeded off a bridge in northern Baghdad. "We have lost count, we have hundreds and hundreds of dead and injured," said a health ministry official. "We can't tell how many are dead. Many bodies are still in the river."

    Most of the dead were women and children, a source in Iraq's Interior Ministry said. They died in the crush or drowned in the Tigris river.

    Streets in the area of the accident are narrow making it extremely difficult for rescue workers to reach the dead and injured.

    Iraq's Prime Minister Ibrahim Jaafari declared three days of mourning.

    Police say the stampede may have been caused when rumours spread that a suicide bomber was prepared to blow himself up.

    Television reports said about one million pilgrims from Baghdad and region had gathered near the Imam Mousa al-Kadim shrine in the capital's Kadhimiya district. They were there for the annual commemoration of the death of the Shia saint.

    Tensions have been high between religious and ethnic communities leading up to a referendum on a new constitution for Iraq.

    Parliament completed work on a draft constitution on Sunday. It must be approved by a popular mandate before Oct. 15 to come into force.

    About two hours before the disaster, a mortar and rocket attack killed at least seven people and injured at least 40 near the shrine. U.S. Apache helicopters fired on the attackers, a U.S. statement said.
    Last edited by PassItOn; 08-31-2005, 06:14 AM.
    "When the government fears the people there is liberty; when the people fear the government there is tyranny."
    --Thomas Jefferson

  • #2
    RIP to those people

    Comment


    • #3
      Oh here's me thinking that installing a multi-party election, or a so-called democracy, was a gift from the gods that automatically made Iraq safer from an alleged tyrant.

      Comment


      • #4
        ^ Really stupid comment.

        This was a CLEAR attack on "MUSLIMS". Muslims attacking muslims. These people are savages. They werent attacking some 'occupation'. They werent attacking some 'muslim puppet government'. They attacked citizens of Iraq who were following a religous tradition - something all 3 'rival' factions of the iraqi muslim religions take part in.
        Warpox exposes himself | Editorial 1 4 | 2Pox

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by TheWalrus
          ^ Really stupid comment.

          This was a CLEAR attack on "MUSLIMS". Muslims attacking muslims. These people are savages. They werent attacking some 'occupation'. They werent attacking some 'muslim puppet government'. They attacked citizens of Iraq who were following a religous tradition - something all 3 'rival' factions of the iraqi muslim religions take part in.
          When did any of this type of attacks happen under Saddam? Saddams regime was effective in protecting the majority of the population. It had the highest standard of living in the Middle East until U.S. led embargos murdered one million people in the 90's. You might think because Saddam was giving Palestinian suicide bombers' widows 25,000 USD it is worth all this death and destruction, but those with morals should not.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by | K Y L E |
            When did any of this type of attacks happen under Saddam?
            It didn't, because Saddam's minority held onto control of the government and prevented the other two muslim versions/religions from participating. Worse things happened under Saddam. Like, when someone got caught stealing.. they would be tortured. I'm sure you've seen the same videos online. The criminal's fingers are cut off one by one, then his hand, then below the elbow.. sickening.

            Saddams regime was effective in protecting the majority of the population.
            Correction: The minority

            ... yet obviously they werent protected considering he forced them into a costly war with iran, and then attacked kuwait, and drove the world into war with his people.. forcing them to live under sanctions because he was a "tough guy" who lived in palaces while his people suffered the consequences of his inaction.

            It had the highest standard of living in the Middle East until U.S. led embargos murdered one million people in the 90's.
            Wrong, wrong, and wrong again. Do you even have proof? What about Israel? Right there, you're wrong - but if you mean "Arab-only" countries, then please mention the UAE, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and other countries who are MUCH MORE well off then Iraq in 1990 (which, ironically, was only a year after his unsuccessful 8year war with Iran.)

            You might think because Saddam was giving Palestinian suicide bombers' widows 25,000 USD it is worth all this death and destruction, but those with morals should not.
            Those with morals support a man who funded terrorism?

            Only in Holland...
            Warpox exposes himself | Editorial 1 4 | 2Pox

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by TheWalrus
              It didn't, because Saddam's minority held onto control of the government and prevented the other two muslim versions/religions from participating. Worse things happened under Saddam. Like, when someone got caught stealing.. they would be tortured. I'm sure you've seen the same videos online. The criminal's fingers are cut off one by one, then his hand, then below the elbow.. sickening.
              As far as I know Saudi Arabia is the worst country in the region for using torture. Yet your President holds his hand while going for a little stroll.


              If you think 100,000 Iraqi deaths due to America is worse than 100,000 tortured Iraqis due to Saddam then you are pretty fucked up.



              Correction: The minority

              ... yet obviously they werent protected considering he forced them into a costly war with iran, and then attacked kuwait, and drove the world into war with his people.. forcing them to live under sanctions because he was a "tough guy" who lived in palaces while his people suffered the consequences of his inaction.
              What do you mean by forced? If you knew the Iraqi-Iran war you would understand that Khomeni was the one that caused the long conflict, even though Saddam started it. Again it was the United States that forced the Iraqi people to live under sanctions, not Saddam. The consequences were not because of the Iran war (his country remained excellent after it) or the Kuwait war, it was because of the genocidal action brought upon by the American government on Iraq.



              Wrong, wrong, and wrong again. Do you even have proof? What about Israel? Right there, you're wrong - but if you mean "Arab-only" countries, then please mention the UAE, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and other countries who are MUCH MORE well off then Iraq in 1990 (which, ironically, was only a year after his unsuccessful 8year war with Iran.)

              "UNICEF reported on March 28, 2003 that, "The Education system in Iraq, prior to 1991, was one of the best in the region, with over 100% Gross Enrolment Rate for primary schooling and high levels of literacy, both of men and women. The Higher Education, especially the scientific and technological institutions, was of an international standard, staffed by high quality personnel". In the 1980s, a successful government program to eradicate illiteracy among Iraqi men and women was implemented."

              "According to the World Health Organisation (WHO),

              "Iraq had a modern sanitary infrastructure with an extensive network of water-purification and sewage-treatment systems. Water networks distributed clean, safe water to 95% of the urban population and to 75% of those in rural areas. In 1990, Iraq was ranked 50th out of 130 countries on the UNDP Human Development Index, which measures national achievements in health, education, and per capita GDP".


              http://www.globalresearch.ca

              "Iraq boasted one of the most modern infrastructures and highest standards of living in the Middle East. The world's second largest oil producer, it had in recent decades used oil revenues for ambitious projects and development programmes, as well as to build one of the most powerful armed forces in the Arab world. It had established a modern, complex health care system, with giant hospitals built on Western models and using the latest equipment. It had constructed sophisticated water-treatment and pumping facilities. It had an extensive school and university system. By 1990, therefore, Iraq presented some of the features typical of a modern society: reliance on imported food (about 70% of the calories in Iraq were imported in the 1980s), dependence on imported technology and engineering skills, and interdependence of the different branches of the economy -- accompanied by an attitude that "the government will do it for you" and "to replace is better than to repair".
              No wonder, then, that Iraq's infrastructure should have proved so vulnerable to the effects of comprehensive trade sanctions, and with such devastating effect on the lives of civilians. The population, in particular doctors, technicians, and teachers, are now exposed to third-world problems which they had never been prepared to deal with.
              "
              http://www.icrc.org

              It is a renowned fact that Iraq pre-Gulf War was a great developing nation excluding democratic institutions.


              Those with morals support a man who funded terrorism?

              Only in Holland...
              How do you work out that I support Saddam? If supporting is balancing the facts and coming to the conclusion that Saddams regime pre-American involvement is FAR superior then you can call it all you want.
              Last edited by | K Y L E |; 08-31-2005, 08:37 AM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by | K Y L E |
                Saudi Arabia is the worst country in the region for using torture.
                Source?

                If you think 100,000 Iraqi deaths due to America is worse than 100,000 tortured Iraqis due to Saddam then you are pretty fucked up.
                Accidental deaths > Intentional deaths.

                ...which is why first degree murderers are jailed for life and those convicted of manslaughter only get a few years

                Saddam is responsible for millions of deaths.
                - The UN voted he was the aggressor in the Iran War
                - He gassed his own people
                - He launched a war with Kuwait
                - He sent scud missiles into Israel and Saudi Arabia
                - He paid, on average, $1 a day to his nations healthcare in the late 90's/early 00's while living in palaces.
                - He is directly responsible for sanctions because of his tough guy attitude, his bullying negoiating tactics, and his lack of respect for any non-syrian non-palestinian arab country and any democratic nation in the world.

                Again it was the United States that forced the Iraqi people to live under sanctions, not Saddam.
                It was the United Nations, buddy.

                The consequences were not because of the Iran war (his country remained excellent after it) or the Kuwait war, it was because of the genocidal action brought upon by the American government on Iraq.
                Explain to me how...

                1. America is commititing genocide
                2. How Iraq remained "Excellent" after the Iran war, despite not being able to pay off its debts for the war and attacking kuwait primarily due to that fact.

                In the 1980s financial problems caused by massive expenditures in the eight-year war with Iran and damage to oil export facilities by Iran led the government to implement austerity measures, borrow heavily, and later reschedule foreign debt payments; Iraq suffered economic losses from the war of at least US$100 billion. After hostilities ended in 1988, oil exports gradually increased with the construction of new pipelines and restoration of damaged facilities. A combination of low oil prices, onerous repayment of the war debts (at around US$3 billion a year) and the costs of reconstruction resulted in a serious financial crisis which was the main short term motivation for the invasion of Kuwait.
                Your main point in saying Iraq remained "excellent" was that it (somehow) had SUPERB INFRASTRUCTURE despite NOT INVESTING IN IT!!!

                Thus Iraq devoted 37.9% of its oil revenue to military expenditure in 1975, 75% in 1980, 77% in 1985, and 89% in 1989.
                Most of Iraq was DEVASTATED after the war with Iran

                The Iraqi treasury, which held $35 billion in reserves at the start of the war, was depleted. Iraq emerged from the war with a crippling external debt of $46 billion, with a further $40 billion contributed by Arab states. Iraqis lived the last years of the war in a state of siege, with dwindling resources and sealed off from the world. Cities in the south like Basra were ruined, and Iraq's infrastructure lay in tatters. Meanwhile, all of Iraq's revenue, including heavy borrowing and outright assistance, were steered to the military industry. Its human resources were diverted to the war, while other Arabs and foreign nationals had to be imported to carry on the country's business.


                Originally posted by Kyle/UNICEF
                "UNICEF reported on March 28, 2003 that, "The Education system in Iraq, prior to 1991, was one of the best in the region, with over 100% Gross Enrolment Rate for primary schooling and high levels of literacy, both of men and women. The Higher Education, especially the scientific and technological institutions, was of an international standard, staffed by high quality personnel". In the 1980s, a successful government program to eradicate illiteracy among Iraqi men and women was implemented."
                Education does not equal "the best" standard of living. Very high levels of cubans can read, do they have the best standard of living?

                "According to the World Health Organisation (WHO),

                "Iraq had a modern sanitary infrastructure with an extensive network of water-purification and sewage-treatment systems. Water networks distributed clean, safe water to 95% of the urban population and to 75% of those in rural areas. In 1990, Iraq was ranked 50th out of 130 countries on the UNDP Human Development Index, which measures national achievements in health, education, and per capita GDP".
                50th out of 130 countries? Sanitation to only 75% of rural areas?

                You SPECIFICALLY said it had the highest standard of living in the Middle East. You are CLEARLY wrong, and you are using useless facts like this to substantiate it? Israel is light years ahead of Iraq. In the 1980's, the UAE and Jordan were well ahead of Iraq. Likely Egypt and Saudi Arabia was too.

                It is a renowned fact that Iraq pre-Gulf War was a great developing nation excluding democratic institutions.
                Pre-world-war-two germany was a great developing nation, excluding democratic institutions, gas chambers, and blatant hatred for mankind!

                How do you work out that I support Saddam? If supporting is balancing the facts and coming to the conclusion that Saddams regime pre-American involvement is FAR superior then you can call it all you want.
                I dont consider Iraq's new regime fully formed, it's in the formation process, but I dont consider the older Iraq better. I consider it safer, but not for long.

                GDP has grown (on average) 53% the last two years since the invasion (wikipedia) meaning things are taking place that will have long term effects.

                However, since the invasion of Iraq in 2003 and subsequent transformation of the political and economic landscape, the economy of Iraq has been growing at a rate of 53% GDP every year.
                The country now has 200,000 troops and police officiers who are gradually taking over the security of the nation and are finally showing they are capable in bigger and more dangerous situations.
                Last edited by TheWalrus; 08-31-2005, 09:00 AM.
                Warpox exposes himself | Editorial 1 4 | 2Pox

                Comment


                • #9
                  don't worry guys, george bush has it under control, everything will be fine.

                  the ends justify the means. 600 might be dead now, but halliburton gets more contracts and work done.
                  So who are we to complain? Leave that to the Iraqi mourners.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Ok serious now.
                    That's how the "peaceful" moslems operate?

                    Most of the dead were women and children, Interior Ministry spokesman Lt. Col. Adnan Abdul-Rahman said. It was the single biggest confirmed loss of life in Iraq since the March 2003 invasion. Health Ministry spokesman Qassim Yahya said 695 were killed and 180 injured.


                    Nice.

                    I will remember that peace lesson when I'm teaching my children what peace means according to today's standards.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      It was a stampede caused by panic. Shit like that always happens in these countries because they insist on having these types of religous ceremonies.

                      > Saudi Arabia
                      http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/...in607644.shtml

                      >India
                      http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4204877.stm
                      http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/3619531.stm
                      http://uk.news.yahoo.com/050729/325/foh79.html

                      > Pakistan
                      http://www.themoscowtimes.com/storie...03/04/259.html

                      The point: the stampede is unrelated to Bush, America, or anything else you want to blame it on. It hapened because a muslim tradition was scared shitless because of other muslims.
                      Warpox exposes himself | Editorial 1 4 | 2Pox

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        ^ It happened because the country is fundamentally divided and on the verge of a civil war which the interim govt has no power to prevent. It happened because the occupying forces are unable to bring an extremely turbulent situation under control. It happened because two primary groups are deeply suspicious of one another, it happened because there have been 100's of successful suicide bombings and therefore a simple rumour has the ability to cause widespread panic.

                        The stampede is very much related to the current tensions that underlie daily existence in Iraq since the invasion and subsequent occupation, thus it has a great deal to do with Bush - remember the occupying force is responsible for the safety of those under its occupation and the handover as well as the January "election" do not change the fact that the country is in fact occupied by well over 100 000 foreign troops.
                        "Nationalism is an infantile sickness. It is the measles of the human race."

                        -Albert Einstein

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Stampedes happen because of the way these marches occur. There is a million people thrown together into a tight-knit group and they walk over bridges, streets, and roads without having a proper safety march like you would see in the states. God Forbid the USA attempted to enforce safety, we'd be hearing people crying about the troops infringing on muslim tradition...

                          The event was looked after by Iraqi troops, and thus they bear more of the responsibility in my opinion. Bush and the white house do have a responsibility to ensure the safety of iraq and they are doing that by putting lives on the line and losing soldiers for the sole purpose of creating a peace. It's almost too easy to blame Bush these days for something he is legitimately trying to fix - which is the nation of iraq. It's rather difficult for people to look at the cause of the problem and realize that muslim extremists inside and outside of iraq are breeding this terrorism everywhere.

                          I look at the broader picture and realize that muslim terrorists have bombed countries before bush. The USS cole and the bombing of the WTC occurred under clinton's watch - NOT president Bush's. What about the embassy bombings in Tanzania? What about the unprovoked attack on 9.11? WHy is Bush suddenly to blame for terror attacks in iraq when they have occured in saudi arabia, israel, jordan, egypt, pakistan, india, and other countries - for decades? What has changed, the presidents name? Why arent you looking at the real focus of the problem. Corrupt regimes. Corrupt muslim clerics who preach hatred. The willingness of the PLO and Syria to allow Hamas and Hezbollah to dominate politics. The 'live by the gun' mentality in the middle east. All of this does more to harm iraq and the world then Bush does, but I wouldnt expect you or any of the less educated liberals on here to admit that.
                          Warpox exposes himself | Editorial 1 4 | 2Pox

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            ^ I agree with what you are saying. It's the exact reason that the war in Iraq is a bad idea (to me). Hatred is really what is being fought here. No way will terrorism ever be eliminated. NEVER going to happen. EVER. EVER. EVER. Can't be achieved.

                            The thing is, even if the intentions are pure, even if the goal is just, it doesn't make a bit of difference. Muslims see this as an occupying force on their land and react accordingly. This will also NEVER change.

                            I can assure you that if ANY country decided that they were going to overthrow my government, I'd be extremely wary of any other possibly motivations. If I saw a video of ONE soldier saying "Killing is great, I want to do it again!" or saw ONE picture of a place like Abu Gahrib, I'd hit the fucking roof. You guys would too. You'd start to question things. It's natural.

                            Sure, Saddam was an asshole. I don't think anyone sane can say otherwise. But breeding a new generation of terrorists in a country that had very few terrorists in it (not NONE, that's preposterous, every country on Earth has terrorists in it) is counterproductive and dangerous. It doesn't assure the safety of America, it makes the next generation of children grow up in a war zone. Regardless of the good, people will focus on the negatives. It's inevitable.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Un-American I pretty much agree with everything you say and I find it to be the sad reality. Unfortunately, just because people have perception problems in circumstances thatinvolve them doesnt mean the outside world (3rd party) shouldnt intervene.

                              No way will terrorism ever be eliminated. NEVER going to happen. EVER. EVER. EVER. Can't be achieved.
                              I disagree here. Who would have thought, in 1967, tha Egypt or Jordan would ever make peace with Israel? Who would have ever thought that China and Japan would be as closely tied as they are today?

                              Terrorism such as the Oklahoma city bombing will always happen. Terrorism a la homicide bombings and road side bombings isnt natural and it is fixable. Time will cure.
                              Warpox exposes himself | Editorial 1 4 | 2Pox

                              Comment

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